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Mektah

Multiscope venting.

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I know this probably isn't the right place to vent, but this is really ruining the experience. They don't even try to hide anymore. I've gone deployment for deployment with Sarin and when we're both red he'll switch to the next account. It's completely obvious. 4 new accounts all on the same day.  Always attack consecutively. Ugh.

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We feel your pain man, had dealings with someone that had almost 20, most were for the recruitment cubes but cheating either way, the developers and miss are frequent on the forums, your venting will inquire a response very soon.

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Yes. This is a well moderated game. If it becomes profitable enough, they might need to hire support staff. I can supply a resume if needed... ;) The devs, Silver especially, do an excellent job of showing they actually care about their player(payer)base.

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Mektah, I have investigated and put a suspension on the 3 three alt accounts you suspect are duplicates. The email addresses associated with the accounts are all from the same company so it could be real people, although I agree the activity was suspicious. I have sent the account holders and email requesting more information.

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I received emails from two of the three suspicious accounts shortly after sending them. The claim is it four friends that live together and their email addresses suggest they work together. The website indicates is is a small company, maybe a startup. While it is still possible that it could be a singe person, it is also possible it is four separate people. I've checked it out, sent emails and searched the web. Short of staking out their GPS locations in a van filled with spy gear, there isn't much more I can do.

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I received emails from two of the three suspicious accounts shortly after sending them. The claim is it four friends that live together and their email addresses suggest they work together. The website indicates is is a small company, maybe a startup. While it is still possible that it could be a singe person, it is also possible it is four separate people. I've checked it out, sent emails and searched the web. Short of staking out their GPS locations in a van filled with spy gear, there isn't much more I can do.

On that note; My roommate ^ coworker will be starting qonqr once the android version is out. Coincidentally, we both have the same shift & might look like multiscopers to some extent. Having a toggle option to automatically send your gps location when launching deployments (or every X hours?) might help with automatically filtering out false positives. By extension it could also allow for an automated "Your activity & location patterns appear suspicious to automated systems, Please enable [setting] & be sure to have any players you frequently play near do the same" as sort of a preemptive papertrail to allow for analysis.

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I received emails from two of the three suspicious accounts shortly after sending them. The claim is it four friends that live together and their email addresses suggest they work together. The website indicates is is a small company, maybe a startup. While it is still possible that it could be a singe person, it is also possible it is four separate people. I've checked it out, sent emails and searched the web. Short of staking out their GPS locations in a van filled with spy gear, there isn't much more I can do.

The game requires location access to work. Can you tag zone caps or attacks with location data? 4 friends living together and working together, maybe traveling together is possible, but at some point, they have to go somewhere else, don't they? I mean, they can't all be going to the same place at the same time constantly. If they all have the same coords 100% of the time, they either need a life or they're cheating.

EDIT: I should make sure I've read all posts before replying to one. Tetra beat me to it.

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The game requires location access to work. Can you tag zone caps or attacks with location data? 4 friends living together and working together, maybe traveling together is possible, but at some point, they have to go somewhere else, don't they? I mean, they can't all be going to the same place at the same time constantly. If they all have the same coords 100% of the time, they either need a life or they're cheating.

That is a good point. I think looking at the history of phone locations relative to each other could at least weave out a lot of false positives, but is kind of invasive of privacy (especially in the wake of the latest Verizon/NSA scandal.). You still would get some false positives, like if you have a family vacationing together or something.

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That is a good point. I think looking at the history of phone locations relative to each other could at least weave out a lot of false positives, but is kind of invasive of privacy (especially in the wake of the latest Verizon/NSA scandal.). You still would get some false positives, like if you have a family vacationing together or something.

I don't know if it would necessarily be an invasion of privacy. This would be visible to the game developers only. It's not quite as bad as twitter, facebook, or foursquare publicly sharing everywhere you are. You're agreeing to share your location when you allow the game to access your location.

False positives sure, but it what I'm saying is that there is no way that 4 people can legitimately be travelling together all at the same time 24/7. My wife plays, we live together, but there'd be a lot of differences. I play a LOT and I travel a LOT. My wife plays a little at work and more at home. So if you could tag our locations, you'd see shared location for maybe 7 hours/day on a weekday and all day on the weekends.

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A private business doesn't follow the same burden of law the government does on every aspect. Which is why the government sidestepped the law to give money to companies that will gather that information for them... That said, I'm sure Silver knows what he can and can not gather for data within the boundaries of the law, and of course deny that he's collecting information for any secret government organization that may or may not be watching...

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A private company works under different rules from governments.

Allowing a program to access your personal data or location is you giving that company permission to use that data. Without a comprehensive EULA specifically stating rights and limitations, you are essentially giving open access, with what would be considered a reasonable expectation of privacy and reasonable use. If this company used your data to protect the integrity of the game, authenticity of the server data, and protected your confidentiality, there is no way they would be in violation of anyone's rights. A conservative approach would be to gather the closest zone I'd the user launches from, which could be the stored data as opposed to a GPS coordinate. This would give the user greater protection vs. Being pinpointed within whatever limitations of the phone, GPS, satellite, etc. This is very similar to how IP address coords are regionally bound.

The difference is contract vs criminal law, statute, jurisdiction, etc. A government entity can request information under specific regulations, but if part of a company's business model is to protect anonymity in a way that violates no law, they have no responsibility to store or share that information. What an unethical person does or someone operating under certain guidelines is a unique case.

We all have identifiers that can be used as evidence in one way or another: phone number, mac address, IP address, GPS coords, email address, etc. The simplest way to avoid issues is to do no wrong. Because people can't always do that, that is why information is gathered, for whatever purpose. The idea behind this would be to stop cheating in game, not stalk you.

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As long as Silver is keeping the data to himself and deletes it when it's no longer needed, I support this. I prefer him to collect the data over all the other data-kraken out there. Reading the news these days, there are many.

BTT: Silver is doing a great job on preventing cheats. And surely he needs data for that. We have to accept that there are "bad people" "bad-gamers" out there. Silver has banned several cheaters already that we reported and we fully trust in his judgement.

Btw: We are also a bunch of friends playing Qonqr and sometimes we even drive around together to Qonqr. Many of us have several phones for work reasons but it's an honor - thing not to multiscope for us. It's one thing to Bot-Mine in Eve with friends but another to Autoaim in CS or multiscope in Qonqr. The difference is between "together" and "against".

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I worked through a scenario yesterday that I think will work. I think once the web portal is functional, I will build a cheater checker that will allow players to enter two codenames. We will pull the last 1,000 or 10,000 requests for the two players for the previous 7 days.

I will then go through the list and find any adjacent launches.

A: 7:00 Player 1

B: 7:01 Player 1

C: 7:02 Player 1

D: 7:05 Player 2

E: 7:06 Player 2

F: 7:47 Player 1

G: 7:50 Player 2

H: 7:51 Player 2

In this list you see that launches (C-D), (E-F), (F-G) are adjacent in time. I will calculate how far apart the launches were in both time and distance.

Then we can have a report that shows if all launches occur together.

(C-D) 3 mins 0 Meters apart

(E-F) 41 mins 5 Kilometers apart

(F-G) 3 mins 10 Meters apart

If we found launches that were 1-2 mins apart, but several kilometers apart that is a good indication that it is two different people. If launches that are close together in time are always close together in distance, that is good evidence (not proof) of a cheater. This process doesn't expose any GPS coordinates and the only privacy issue we create is exposing that two players spend time together, which I doubt will surprise anyone who already thinks it is a single person.

If this system is public, the community can help police itself. If cheaters know about this tool, they will need to do lots of work to avoid looking like a cheater. If they are going to go to all that trouble, then I thank you for your QONQR dedication, please buy some cubes. This checker will pull lots of data from our database and will probably be slow. We may need to restrict this tool to being run once per day per player to keep thousands of these requests per hour from bogging down the servers.

We've got the desktop screens for the new paypal checkout in the new web portal complete. Now I'm waiting on the mobile versions. Once that is done we will release the web portal and begin working on the other core components that are needed, but I have moved the cheater checker up the list as a first or second non-critical feature.

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To me having this data able to be drawn by an online portal creates serious privacy concerns. I know qonqr has my precise location for most of the day, and i'm sure its databases host useful alibis for me in the future, but to have public the distance between another player and I in all our most recent launches? This seems odd. I imagine someone with serious time on their hands could even triangulate a players location though this method.

If this is going to actually be implemented I hope this detailed report would not be shown to the searcher. Just an analysis of it. Perhaps a simple true/false analysis.

True/false: Were their most recent launches within two minutes of the other players?

True/false: Were the players scopes within 50 meters of each other?

I love the game but do have privacy concerns, I would opt for another app if too much of my accounts information become publicly available.

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I think you're going to have to hire a full time staff to handle all the requests you're going to get, or outsource it. I ignore the multiscopers now, but I've had suspicions for at least a dozen different accounts, just as I've been accused myself. I think anytime there are friends or family playing together, especially in the same place, you're going to have accusations. And given the amount of people I know playing together, you're going to have tons of requests on your hands.

And for multiscopers trying to get around the system... a new game! :P

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To me having this data able to be drawn by an online portal creates serious privacy concerns. I know qonqr has my precise location for most of the day, and i'm sure its databases host useful alibis for me in the future, but to have public the distance between another player and I in all our most recent launches? This seems odd. I imagine someone with serious time on their hands could even triangulate a players location though this method.

If this is going to actually be implemented I hope this detailed report would not be shown to the searcher. Just an analysis of it. Perhaps a simple true/false analysis.

True/false: Were their most recent launches within two minutes of the other players?

True/false: Were the players scopes within 50 meters of each other?

I love the game but do have privacy concerns, I would opt for another app if too much of my accounts information become publicly available.

it's not showing where you were, just how far you were from the other suspect.

one potential idea to cut down on requests is if after someone checks & sees they are obviously different people, add list of all the people previously checking

a given pair who decided not to report the suspects

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I agree with Rocco, while multi scoping is a pain in the backside its just one of those things that go on. I just like to look down on these types of players with a sneer, knowing they suck.:-/

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How about this: 2 brothers playing qonqr and live in the same area, but different devices. Could that count as cheating? Thanks. I might have the same case. Who knows? I just need Silver to answer this. Thank you. :)

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How about this: 2 brothers playing qonqr and live in the same area, but different devices. Could that count as cheating? Thanks. I might have the same case. Who knows? I just need Silver to answer this. Thank you. :)

if you help your brother deploy then is cheat....but who knows ==

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